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Wake up mshsaa, girls wrestling is growing


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Cement Mixer doesn't like my quote from the best movie of all time. What if we, as a country, didn't believe that you must risk to receive. Henry Ford would never have started building cars. There wouldn't be a beautiful hospital for children in Memphis. Here's a thought, if you aren't willing to help build it, don't condemn others who are trying to build a future for females in the great sport of wrestling.

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Cement Mixer doesn't like my quote from the best movie of all time. What if we, as a country, didn't believe that you must risk to receive. Henry Ford would never have started building cars. There wouldn't be a beautiful hospital for children in Memphis. Here's a thought, if you aren't willing to help build it, don't condemn others who are trying to build a future for females in the great sport of wrestling.

I tried using the quote "If you build it, they will come" when I walked into a bank asking for a bank loan. Unfortunately I didn't have financial data to help support my cause. Yes, I get the quote, but just saying the quote doesn't make it happen. We need numbers, facts, data, stats to take to MSHSAA. I'm sure not condemning female wrestling, I'd like to help, but it seems like you all are hiding facts/data. Share it, let it go viral. Same with results, we want to see them. Your fans are practically begging you for results so we can help support female wrestling. Perhaps get your head out of the sand and let the fans see your product. If you are building it, the fans will come. Well, the fans are here and you are not producing.

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How about you read Jonathan's posts about the results being prepared by Miki, and sending him an email if you want more information on his survey. In the alternative you can just take pot shots at me. Have a great day or not, the choice is yours.

 

This is just really weird overall. I'm practically begging you to help.

 

- Jonathan Bowen - post the results and data for everyone to see. Put it on dropbox, google docs, etc. It's 2016, find a way to spread the word.

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I am the Missouri USA Girls Coordinator. I am not representing the entire state of Missouri trying to get girls high school wrestling installed. That is just something I would like to see. In the area of getting girls to go to Fargo, last year we took five girls. Thus far, it appears we will be taking eight to ten. I nominate cementMixer to be the contact person for getting people organized to get girls high school wrestling through MSHSAA. That way I can focus on getting girls ready for Fargo.

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I am the Missouri USA Girls Coordinator. I am not representing the entire state of Missouri trying to get girls high school wrestling installed. That is just something I would like to see. In the area of getting girls to go to Fargo, last year we took five girls. Thus far, it appears we will be taking eight to ten. I nominate cementMixer to be the contact person for getting people organized to get girls high school wrestling through MSHSAA. That way I can focus on getting girls ready for Fargo.

 

Sounds like Bowen is the contact person, but can't figure out how to get results out or post survey data. I just want to help get the word out, but no one wants to get the info out to fans.

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Sounds like Bowen is the contact person, but can't figure out how to get results out or post survey data. I just want to help get the word out, but no one wants to get the info out to fans.

I'm with you! Not sure why information is not being funneled out to individuals who would support this initiative. Seems odd to me.

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Not exactly sure that I care for this final portion from the survey. Kind of underhanded way of asking for coaches' opinion with a survey. I don't know that I've ever taken a survey where people are allowed to see my personal responses to the questions. Doesn't matter to me in this instance, I have my opinion and would be perfectly comfortable with my responses, but still seems a little shady.

 

If the coach didn’t answer the questions to your satisfaction, understand that it is their opinion. If you have questions about specific head coaches; if they responded, their responses, or specific comments that were written, feel free to email me at: Jonathan_Andrew_Bowen@yahoo.com

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First off, Thanks to our admin the survey results are now posted. I tried a few different formats but nothing took when I attempted. I guess I will just email him directly if anything else of importance needs to be posted.

 

I do know that I have had numerous parents asking me if their local coach was/is on board or not with girls wrestling along with the numerical data interpretation. This allows the parents to go back to their local program and converse about the support for this initiative or the opposite. A significant amount of the inquiries that I did receive was whether or not their local coach responded or not. Not what their coaches said in the written response questions. This is probably due to the fact that most parents have a good idea of where their local coach stands on this particular issue. In regards to the "specific comments, most interested parties asked generalized questions such as, "What are the nay-sayers saying?" Regardless, of opinions though, this data indicates that we could have a solid emerging sport with the projected numbers the coaches gave me. Does anyone know how many boys were participants in the first years of MSHSAA wrestling?

 

In order to get this kind of change to take place, we need the parents, coaches, ADs, etc. communicating with each other.

 

I know people want instant results, feedback, etc. I'm working around the clock to try and make things happen for you. I'm also running the War of the Rose Grand Nationals in Lexington (@ Wentworth), and women's coordinator for Brute Nationals in efforts to get as many girls from Missouri to wrestle in nationally known tournaments. One of the things that would help out immensely would be for everyone who's been following this thread is to contact Pat Ream, the MOUSA Director to push for a Freestyle/Team Missouri qualifier tournament the same weekend as the boys do (May 7-8). The more numbers we can throw at MSHSAA the better off the girls will be.

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Not for sure how the numbers of the first year of MSHSAA wrestling more than a half of a century ago relevant to whether or not adding girls' wrestling is warranted. It has been asked to put up the number of high school girls who competed at the girls' state tournament recently, yet no one will post those numbers.

It seems the more important numbers would be to look at how many female wrestlers are currently participating at the youth level in our state. I've yet to see those numbers.

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I've emailed Miki, who was supposed to be organizing and then posting on the MOUSA site. However, I've yet to hear back. I do know that the last month of Saturdays, she's been either helping with or working on post-season tournaments for MOUSA, including Girls State, Districts, Regionals, and MOUSA State.

 

In regards, to actual numbers:

119: Overall Total Registered Girls (Most per-registered and I have the spreadsheet with their data but there were a few walk-ups that I don't have their data on the spreadsheet)

28 ladies participated in the high school division

38 ladies in the Middle School Age Groups

Total: 66 Girls in Middle School/High School

Total of Rest of Age Groups: 53

Now during the tournament I overheard people complaining that the girls tournament is the same weekend as AAU State and about another 20-30 girls participated in that instead of the Girls State. I have no way of verifying this outside of going through each entry they had on track wrestling and discern whether or not the entry is a boy or a girl (which frankly would be a waste of time). No offense to AAU, but it's not what it once was. Outside of small pockets in St. Louis area, it's pretty much dead in Missouri.

 

I also, had a couple of parents email the week of having to cancel due to illness. So, barring, illness we would have had closer to 125 girls overall.

 

The reason I ask for the historical data, is that those numbers should be comparable to what we should expect during our first years with a girls division. If nothing else, this would offer us some kind of benchmark for the State to look for in terms of growth/projection/stability. If we have better numbers, Great! However, having a benchmark/goal is something needed.

 

If you were to take the 66 girls who are currently wrestling at the MS/HS level and the high end of the coaches' survey projected numbers (250) and find the mean and range of this data to give us a middle of the road estimate for a first year total between 158-184 girls.

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  • 4 weeks later...

Little late to the party. Anyway, to say you have to wait until participation numbers is up is asinine.

Numbers will never go up until there girls have their own division. What do you think participation levels would be for girls if they had to play on the boys teams in basketball? Or soccer? They would be very low because of the differences in physical abilities between girls and boys. For a girl to compete at the HS level with boys, she has to be National Champuon level. Ali Howk won Cadet Nationals last summer in Fargo. She qualified for state this February in Class 4. Most girls aren't the level Ali is. They can't compete against boys.

Then factor in the nature of wrestling. Any idea how many don't wrestle because they don't stand a chance physically against boys at the HS level? Or how many aren't allowed to by their parents due to the perceived dangers for a girl wrestling a boy?

This IS a build it and they will come. Our local HS team had 1 girl on the team. If MSHSAA let it as a provisional sport next season with a state championship (guess what Michigan just did it), our school would be able to field 10-15. And they would be girls who have wrestling experience but quit at the JH or HS level because they couldn't compete with the boys anymore for a reason similar to what I stated above.

Then it boils down to this. Title IX has been disasterous for our sport. How to nullify it?? By having girls wrestling. You have a boy and girl program at your school, there will be no worries about your programs eliminated.

Do you love wrestling and want to see growth? Advocate for MSHSAA to sanction girls divisions.

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Waiting for adequate numbers is not asinine, it is common sense. Not only do you have to convince MSHSAA, but individual schools do as well. I do not know of any schools that are going to dish out more cash to add a new program, without providing some evidence of interest. Schools do not operate under hypothetical "if you build it they will come" logic when making financial decisions.

Bringing up Title IX is also nothing more than a fear tactic. I am not aware of any HS program in our state that has been threatened because there is not a corresponding female program. I do not know of anyone that is "worrying" about this. If this were the case, schools better start adding girls' football programs, after all if you build it they were come. If anything girls' wrestling at the Olympic level has decrease opportunities at the highest level for male wrestlers.

Quite frankly, I get tired of the if you love wrestling you must support girls' wrestling comments. I don't see it anywhere else. I don't see if you love the NBA, you must support the WNBA, etc. I love wrestling, but am more interested in increasing participation numbers among existing programs.

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I'm not sure on that. I just know about this one since I was one of the coaches that sent in the document to have it discussed at the wrestling advisory board meeting. Hopefully they will post the meeting minutes soon on the MSHSAA website.

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I'm not sure on that. I just know about this one since I was one of the coaches that sent in the document to have it discussed at the wrestling advisory board meeting. Hopefully they will post the meeting minutes soon on the MSHSAA website.

Gothcha... Thanks.

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