This one is too good that I need to chime in as well.
Loethen, there are many things as a coach that we need to teach our wrestlers. I agree with standing up for a wrestler when there is what we feel is a wrong call, etc. during a match. However, as another poster stated most of the calls are subjective. There are rules in place to approach the referee and meet with him at the table and discuss your point in a calm manner with integrity, and then it is up to the referee to make the call. If it is a disagreement on a rule, then I suggest having your rule book with you and discussing the rule with the referee and having the head referee settle your disagreement.
In being loud, boisterous and intimidating you are not teaching anything to anybody other than how to be a jackass. If you carry yourself in a respectful manner with integrity and stick up for what you believe in, you will not get kicked out and you can be proud of your actions. You have then showed that you are a leader.
I can admit that I have lost my cool on the mat before (never to the point of being tossed), but I will not defend that behavior. I was ashamed of it, and have apologized to my son for it, and have grown and learned from it.
To defend that type of behavior is just idiocracy at its best.
As far as the original intentions for this post, both Purler and Eierman bring good things to the table. It is up the parent and wrestler to see what benefits them the most, and where they fit in the best. There are great people that train with both Eierman and Purler. There are also some bad apples and their behavior has direct reflection on their affiliation.
This is why I don't coach or officiate youth wrestling anymore. Most of the coaches don't know how to approach the official in a calm and respectful manner. Most of the officials are inexperienced with dealing with coaches and don't know how to handle the situation.
It's just sad that youth wrestling has to have such issues with coaches being more right than the officials and the wrestlers having to have inexperienced officials because the better officials don't want to deal with the youth coaches.
Chief, I suspect - I hope - you based your decision on much more than the behavior of others. Turning the chicken coop over to the foxes can result in only one outcome. Are you counting on the pendulum effect - waiting for it to get so bad that change will be demanded? I hope not as well, because that is a very prolonged and brutal slow swing to the worst extremes and back.
Originally Posted by chiefjoker
No, what is needed are individuals that get what it means to be a coach, mentor and friend and the impact they have on the lives of those around them. They must step up to the plate, act in the responsible, moral, mature manner that is called for. They must be the example for the hundreds of pairs of wrestler's eyes that witness their own coach and every other coach act out every weekend.
This includes the Purlers, the Eiermans, those with military or educator backgrounds, those that sit in the coaches corner, stand at the edge of the mat, or in the stands to yell. I'm not calling any one particular person out. I am calling each and every one of us out!
We all have a responsibility that supercedes wrestling. Wrestling gives us the opportunity to do something right about it - or not so right.
(stepping back off of soap box )
I never said anything about not approaching an official in anything but a calm and respectful manner. I never said anything about being disrespectful. However, I have seen refs be disrespectful to coaches also, and the coach is expected just to take it. I have also seen refs be so wrong, to the point where they were shown in a rule book and had the head ref tell them afterwards they were wrong, still they couldn't admit the mistake. I haven't coached youth wrestling in 4 years, but 9 times out of 10 the coach is more experienced than some the refs, it is what it is. A 25 yr old ref will never have more exp than a man who has coached for 20 years, he just can't
Originally Posted by chiefjoker
Now I have coached 1,000,s of matches and only been kicked out three times. Two of the times were because my wrestler was being hurt by an illegal move and the ref would not stop the action. The other time because the other coach was verbally abusing my wrestler on the mat. All 3 times I was standing up for my wrestler and preventing him from being hurt due to the incompetence of the official.
My overall point because a coach is kicked out it doesn't make him good or bad and guess what you don't know the circumstances. So don't pass judgment on Mike just because he was kicked out for arguing with a ref, in his case there aren't many refs with more experience them him
I've been kicked out of a tournament when a Ref went after another wrestler that had nothing to do with what was going on. I stepped in and drew the Refs attention to me and off the wrestler. I got tossed and the Ref later lied about the incident. 4 different wittness's verified my accounting.
My point is Just because someone has the Authority to do something does not mean they are right for doing it.
Eierman has not been kicked out of a tournament and if you think so, then please let me know what tournament.
I have seen the growth Eierman has had in his years as a coach and he has only improved every step of the way. If anything, he is the one stepping back and telling the other coaches/dads that we may not have gotten that call this time but we will get it next time. He has not been perfect and shows emotion just like anyone else and is there to stand up for his wrestler. No different than I witnessed at the Big 12 Tournament with John Smith, Brian Smith and Kevin Jackson with the refs.
He doesn't expect anything other than his wrestlers giving 100% and the outcome rather if it be a bad call/loss/win, he is there for them and then places the energy back into the wrestling room for them to improve. Of course as a coach, he wants a win, but more importantly he is looking at the long term career of the wrestler...high school, college, Olympics and he sees that potential in ALL of his wrestlers.
All of the issues I have heard regarding him have had nothing to do with his coaching abilities or growth he has made and I believe he deserves that respect, whether you like him or not. I do appreciate hearing there are some neutral and positive feedback/respect out there.
mlundy, I have no idea where your post is going with my comment.
When I coached youth wrestling I never had to get kicked out to get my point across. I found that talking to the officials in a respectful manner later in the day or even after the tournament was over that I could influence the officials more than trying to get in a heated confrontation out on the mat at that moment. I gained more respect from the official as the season went on and throughout the years.
From an officials point of view I find that the coaches are wrong 99 of 100 times. I also find that the coaches that get more heated over calls are the coaches that coach their own kids. I have had to toss plenty of coaches in USA wrestling, I have also put up with plenty of coaches who should have been tossed. I never seem to have had this issue on the high school level or even the junior high level.
For ever 1 coach that gets heated and has to go off, gets thrown out, makes a huge scene, there are about 15 video cameras recording the incident, waiting to post it on youtube and letting the media find it and dragging down the sport. I read almost daily about a coach going off about something, doing some act as a result that crosses the line, ex. coach bites another coaches ear off, and that coach believes 100% that they are right. It is still not the way to act as a coach, period.
This post was not about Loethen being tossed out of any tourneys it was about a club and a coach.
I will be the first to admit that years ago I was NOT a fan of the EE coach at all. This was because he did say verbal things to my wrestler and the club singlet we were wearing at the time. So I can admit first hand I was one of the one who judged him many times over and had nothing good to say at all, but I only spoke what happened to me personally and this was years ago.
Last year at the Regional dual tournament I was again coaching against Mike. I can say he was nothing more then a true gentleman to myself and our wrestlers. In fact we talked several times that day about certain matches and I kept thinking to myself he has changed and so called "grown" up as a coach. I have always thought he has been a good coach and had the skills to take kids to the next levels, I just did not like at the time what I saw as a person. People change and I moved on.
There are many great clubs, coaches, and programs in the state of Missouri now and if us dads can get over our own egos we will keep growing as a state. Me must get some of our coaches of their high horses and realize that extra practices of wrestling with kids who WANT to be in those rooms are choosing to excel in this tough sport. I have been around wrestling in some way or another for 35 years now and have seen the good bad and ugly. There is nothing I hate more then hearing a coach forbids of frowns on wrestlers attending open mats, Purler, Eirman, Victory, or any other practice.
So my point is that people change and most if not ALL bickering on this board comes from simple jealousy!!! nothing more!!
Or, maybe, they have had a bad experience with EE, much like yourself in the past. Were you jealous?
Originally Posted by JT Harden
Very much so at the time because his wrestler did beat my son!!
Originally Posted by cementMixer